Don't hide menus

[Daniel]

On 2023-10-14 03:52, Daniel wrote:
> On 2023-10-13 18:07, Daniel wrote:
>> On 2023-10-13 17:24, Jürgen Spitzmüller wrote:
>>> Am Freitag, dem 13.10.2023 um 17:08 +0200 schrieb Daniel:
>>>> I agree that the menus of these apps are complex. But that might be
>>>> in their nature.
>>>
>>> Well, they are aware of it:
>>> https://design.blog.documentfoundation.org/2016/01/22/way-down-in-the-libreoffice-menus/
> 
> Notice that the (obvious?) option of removing disabled menu entries 
> apparently wasn't a viable option.
> 
>>>> I guess the Ribbon was a (maybe controversial) attempt to
>>>> solve this problem.
>>>
>>> Yes, probably. With the result that you don't find things anymore at
>>> all. And Ribbons even more infringe the policy you refer to. They hide
>>> function from the user if they place it in (rather opaque) categories.
>>>
>>>> But I think LyX with its hidden menus is actually
>>>> worse to figure out. I am still discovering (otherwise) hidden menu
>>>> entries and I have been using LyX for quite some time now.
>>>
>>> I keep on discovering menu entries in LO and Word although they have
>>> been displayed all the time.
>>>
>>> It might be different habits, but I search for menu entries when I need
>>> them. And this is when they are usually enabled.
>>
>> The problem is that one does not even know what to look for if one 
>> doesn't know of a possible functionality. This seems even worse in LyX 
>> because it is in certain ways a more unique application.
>>
>>> In context when they do not work at all they only distract attention.
>>
>> I have not noticed that. I usually find that disabled menus are easy 
>> to disregard when I do not explicitly try to discover some function. 
>> And typically I have greater problems with disregarding stuff than 
>> other people.
>>
>> Another problem with disappearing menus is that the other menus shift 
>> positions. That is a bit annoying too.
>>
>>> If I want to learn about LyX's functionality, I consult the manuals.
>>
>> I think people typically don't read software manuals. Maybe too bad 
>> but a fact that developers should honor. Maybe LyX users are different 
>> but I have my doubts.
>>
>>>> If it is really necessary to cut down on menu entries in the "Insert"
>>>> menu when disabled entries get enabled: For example, create a
>>>> separate "References" menu.
>>>
>>> References is just a single submenu in the Insert menu. That won't
>>> solve the problem. And, after all, if References are to be _inserted_,
>>> I would expect them under Insert.
>>
>> I meant the group of "References" as in "Citation", 
>> "Cross-References", "Label", "Caption", etc. These are typically 
>> subsumed under "References" in other word processors. (But if more 
>> entries for such a menu are needed, then entries in 
>> "List/TOC/References" might be added as well.)
> 
> The attached patch exemplifies this (radical?) change.

Want to go wild? Also add a "Format" menu. Probably more items can be 
added there. But this is one way.

I am not persuaded yet that LyX's menus are actually too long. But for 
what it's worth...

Daniel
-------------- next part --------------
From dd37294bdc00ccd2d65231d83199297bea23a7fa Mon Sep 17 00:00:00 2001
From: Daniel Ramoeller <d.lyx at web.de>
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 2023 04:06:44 +0200
Subject: [PATCH 2/2] Add a "Format" main menu

Add a "Format" main menu
---
 lib/ui/stdmenus.inc | 18 ++++++++++++------
 1 file changed, 12 insertions(+), 6 deletions(-)

diff --git a/lib/ui/stdmenus.inc b/lib/ui/stdmenus.inc
index 4a8b9d1c28..ea7d0db218 100644
--- a/lib/ui/stdmenus.inc
+++ b/lib/ui/stdmenus.inc
@@ -32,6 +32,7 @@ Menuset
 		Submenu "View|V" "view"
 		Submenu "Insert|I" "insert"
 		Submenu "References|R" "references"
+		Submenu "Format|O" "format"
 		Submenu "Navigate|N" "navigate"
 		Submenu "Document|D" "document"
 		Submenu "Tools|T" "tools"
@@ -121,12 +122,6 @@ Menuset
 		Item "Move Paragraph Up|o" "paragraph-move-up"
 		Item "Move Paragraph Down|v" "paragraph-move-down"
 		Separator
-		Item "Paragraph Settings...|P" "layout-paragraph"
-		Submenu "Text Properties|x" "edit_textprops"
-		OptSubmenu "Custom Text Styles|S" "edit_textstyles"
-		Item "Manage Counter Values..." "dialog-show-new-inset counter"
-		LanguageSelector
-		Separator
 # Mathed b0rkage means these don't work properly
 		OptSubmenu "Table|T" "edit_tabular"
 		OptSubmenu "Math|M" "edit_math"
@@ -571,6 +566,17 @@ Menuset
 		Item "Marginal Note|M" "marginalnote-insert"
 	End
 
+#
+# FORMAT MENU
+#
+	Menu "format"
+		Item "Paragraph Settings...|P" "layout-paragraph"
+		Submenu "Text Properties|x" "edit_textprops"
+		OptSubmenu "Custom Text Styles|S" "edit_textstyles"
+		Item "Manage Counter Values..." "dialog-show-new-inset counter"
+		LanguageSelector
+	End
+
 #
 # DOCUMENT MENU
 #
-- 
2.24.3 (Apple Git-128)